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Re: [Maria-discuss] MySQL's future in Debian and Ubuntu
by Alex Esterkin 22 Feb '12

22 Feb '12

As an end user, I would most strongly dislike this. You clearly don't understand how corporate users think and operate, how they work with open source technologies, and how they plan and evolve their technical roadmaps. Last year Ubuntu inflicted enough damage on itself by messing up with UI and display management. Replacing OpenOffice with LibreOffice was not a success story either. A year ago I had plans to migrate my remaining CentOS and Debian servers and test environments to Ubuntu and I recommended using Ubuntu for a couple of server appliance products we had in the works. These plans were revisited and revised in the fall, based on revised Linux distro release and roadmap assessment. As far as MySQL is concerned, I don't care at this point what your Ubuntu server distro plans are, as I have already migrated away from Ubuntu. However, if the discussion about replacing MySQL also spreads into the Fedora Project and CentOS communities, that would give me a very good reason for migrating/porting MySQL apps and products to Postgres. Regards, Alex Esterkin, Former Chief Architect, Infobright On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 04:37, Clint Byrum <clint(a)ubuntu.com> wrote: > Many of us in the Free and Open Source software community have seen a > trend regarding Oracle's stewardship of Open source software that it > inherited when it purchased Sun. In particular there were two fairly > large public project blow ups that resulted in OpenOffice splintering, > and the Hudson community (almost?) completely moving to an independent > fork called Jenkins. > > It has been brought to my attention that MySQL may have gone this way > as well, but in a much more subtle way. This started about a year ago, > and has only recently really become obvious. > > A few notable fellows from the MySQL ecosystem have commented: > > Mark Callaghan > http://mysqlha.blogspot.com/2011/02/where-have-bugs-gone.html > (read the comments on this one, very informative, and most of the > commenters are extremely important non-Oracle members of the MySQL > community) > > http://mysqlha.blogspot.com/2011/11/great-work-bug-12704861-was-fixed.html > > Stewart Smith: > http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2011/11/20/bug12704861/ > > And the CVE's are extremely vague: > > http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2012-0119 > > "Unspecified vulnerability in the MySQL Server component in Oracle MySQL > 5.1.x and 5.5.x allows remote authenticated users to affect availability > via unknown vectors" > > Links to here: > > http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/topics/security/cpujan2012-366304.html > > Which links to here: > > http://support.oracle.com/CSP/main/article?cmd=show&type=NOT&id=1390289.1 > > Which requires an account (which I created). I did try to login but got > some kind of failure.. > > "Failure of server APACHE bridge:". > > The bzr commits for the latest MySQL releases also reference log bug#'s > that are thought to belong to the private oracle support system, not > accessible to non-paying customers. > > This is all very troubling, as in a Linux distribution, we must be able > to support our users and track upstream development. > > So what should we, the Debian and Ubuntu MySQL maintainers and users, > do about this? > > Well there is a Jenkins to MySQL's Hudson, a LibreOffice to their > OpenOffice. > > MariaDB 5.3, in release-candidate now, is 100% backward compatible with > MySQL 5.1. It also includes a few speedups and features that can be found > in MySQL 5.5 and Percona Server. It is developed 100% in the open, on > launchpad.net, including a public bug tracker and up to date bzr trees > of the code. > > http://mariadb.org > https://launchpad.net/maria > > I'm writing to the greater Debian and Ubuntu community to ask for your > thoughts on a proposal to drop MySQL in favor of MariaDB. Its clear to > me that Oracle is not going to do work in the open, and this will become > a huge support burden for Linux distributions. The recent CVE's had to > be hunted down and investigated at great difficulty to several people, > since the KB articles referenced and the internal Oracle bug numbers > referenced were not available. > > This will only get harder as the community bug tracker gets further out > of sync with the private one. > > There is some need to consider acting quickly: > > Ubuntu precise, the next LTS release of Ubuntu will be hitting feature > freeze on Feb. 16. The release, due in April, will be supported with > security updates for 5 years. That may be 5 long years of support if > MySQL continues to obscure things. > > Debian wheezy is still quite far off, but it is critical that this be > done and decided by the time the release freeze begins. > > So, here is a suggested plan, given the facts above: > > * Upload mariadb 5.3 to Debian experimental, with it providing > mysql-server, mysql-client, and libmysqlclient-dev. > > * For Ubuntu users, upload these packages to a PPA for testing > applications for compatibility, and rebuild testing. > > * If testing goes well, replace mysql-5.5 with mariadb in both Debian > unstable and Ubuntu precise. If there are reservations about switching > this late in precise's cycle, ship mysql-5.5 in precise, and push off > Ubuntu's transition until the next cycle. > > Before I strike out on this path alone, which, I understand, may sound > a bit radical, I want to hear what you all think. > > Thank you for your time and consideration. > > -- > Clint Byrum <clint(a)ubuntu.com> > Ubuntu Server Team > Debian MySQL Packaging Team >

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[Maria-discuss] MySQL's future in Debian and Ubuntu
by Clint Byrum 17 Feb '12

17 Feb '12

Many of us in the Free and Open Source software community have seen a trend regarding Oracle's stewardship of Open source software that it inherited when it purchased Sun. In particular there were two fairly large public project blow ups that resulted in OpenOffice splintering, and the Hudson community (almost?) completely moving to an independent fork called Jenkins. It has been brought to my attention that MySQL may have gone this way as well, but in a much more subtle way. This started about a year ago, and has only recently really become obvious. A few notable fellows from the MySQL ecosystem have commented: Mark Callaghan http://mysqlha.blogspot.com/2011/02/where-have-bugs-gone.html (read the comments on this one, very informative, and most of the commenters are extremely important non-Oracle members of the MySQL community) http://mysqlha.blogspot.com/2011/11/great-work-bug-12704861-was-fixed.html Stewart Smith: http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2011/11/20/bug12704861/ And the CVE's are extremely vague: http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2012-0119 "Unspecified vulnerability in the MySQL Server component in Oracle MySQL 5.1.x and 5.5.x allows remote authenticated users to affect availability via unknown vectors" Links to here: http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/topics/security/cpujan2012-366304.html Which links to here: http://support.oracle.com/CSP/main/article?cmd=show&type=NOT&id=1390289.1 Which requires an account (which I created). I did try to login but got some kind of failure.. "Failure of server APACHE bridge:". The bzr commits for the latest MySQL releases also reference log bug#'s that are thought to belong to the private oracle support system, not accessible to non-paying customers. This is all very troubling, as in a Linux distribution, we must be able to support our users and track upstream development. So what should we, the Debian and Ubuntu MySQL maintainers and users, do about this? Well there is a Jenkins to MySQL's Hudson, a LibreOffice to their OpenOffice. MariaDB 5.3, in release-candidate now, is 100% backward compatible with MySQL 5.1. It also includes a few speedups and features that can be found in MySQL 5.5 and Percona Server. It is developed 100% in the open, on launchpad.net, including a public bug tracker and up to date bzr trees of the code. http://mariadb.org https://launchpad.net/maria I'm writing to the greater Debian and Ubuntu community to ask for your thoughts on a proposal to drop MySQL in favor of MariaDB. Its clear to me that Oracle is not going to do work in the open, and this will become a huge support burden for Linux distributions. The recent CVE's had to be hunted down and investigated at great difficulty to several people, since the KB articles referenced and the internal Oracle bug numbers referenced were not available. This will only get harder as the community bug tracker gets further out of sync with the private one. There is some need to consider acting quickly: Ubuntu precise, the next LTS release of Ubuntu will be hitting feature freeze on Feb. 16. The release, due in April, will be supported with security updates for 5 years. That may be 5 long years of support if MySQL continues to obscure things. Debian wheezy is still quite far off, but it is critical that this be done and decided by the time the release freeze begins. So, here is a suggested plan, given the facts above: * Upload mariadb 5.3 to Debian experimental, with it providing mysql-server, mysql-client, and libmysqlclient-dev. * For Ubuntu users, upload these packages to a PPA for testing applications for compatibility, and rebuild testing. * If testing goes well, replace mysql-5.5 with mariadb in both Debian unstable and Ubuntu precise. If there are reservations about switching this late in precise's cycle, ship mysql-5.5 in precise, and push off Ubuntu's transition until the next cycle. Before I strike out on this path alone, which, I understand, may sound a bit radical, I want to hear what you all think. Thank you for your time and consideration.

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Re: [Maria-discuss] MySQL's future in Debian and Ubuntu
by Pandu Poluan 17 Feb '12

17 Feb '12

On Feb 13, 2012 2:21 PM, "Eddie Bachle" <enb10(a)albion.edu> wrote: > > In general, I am generally an simply an observer on most of these mailing lists, however my concerns with a switch are far less technical and far more practical. I work currently for a college in Michigan which utilizes almost solely Windows servers simply because it is what the IT staff here knows. As a student here, I was brought in to assist with the web server administration, and as time went by because I have a degree of Linux knowledge, I was given permission to put together a Ubuntu LAMP server to serve a couple of interested parties on campus who wanted simply to demo several small scale web apps that were Linux exclusive. This server would serve as an exception to the general rule of our server architecture. However as time has went by and my knowledge looks more like it will be a fixture here after graduation, along with the simple instability of PHP and Apache on the Windows platform, my boss is giving far more consideration to moving to Linux. > > As Linux gains more public recognition, more and more Windows-only organizations will consider using it as an alternative, especially for their web servers. This is especially true because of the fact that each of the necessarily main components of a web server exist in Linux in the same form as the do on Windows and often run much better. Then, the only piece one would need to learn would be the new operating system, not the database, HTTP server, or PHP scripting language software. However, this is going to be a more difficult proposition if the aforementioned advantage is somewhat eliminated. Were I to have to tell my boss that we could switch to Ubuntu but it would mean that would need to use a "MySQL compatible" database if we want to use the native database (which we likely would because it's tested to be stable and it is supported by the developers), then she would be much more hesitant. > > There simply is a much greater sense of trepidation for those who are not significantly Linux savvy if there exists a possibility that they would have to make something work in an unfamiliar environment, especially if it were to happen unexpectedly. If we ported our www website server over to Ubuntu and then 6 months down the road we were to upgrade our Joomla version and there became an issue with MariaDB because it lacks some MySQL feature that it needs, or even that Joomla would fail to recognize Maria as being equivalent to MySQL at some point, then that would be a huge detraction against switching. > > Unless assurances that any software that asks for MySQL will recognize and accept MariaDB equivalents, and that this should always be the case, and that it will retain the stability and recognized benefits of MySQL, I would encourage extreme caution in encouraging a switch. Linux is beginning to grow into areas it previously didn't reach and bringing a far superior web server experience as well as simply a better operating system experience for many and I would not like to see that growth compromised. I would like to say we would still switch, or still heavily consider it for the grains that could be made by using Ubuntu, however realistically, the lack of native MySQL in any OS would be a huge mark against it. Also that being said, if the technical concerns are answered adequately for a vast majority of applications and hardware/OS setups, then I would be totally behind switching to a more open source friendly and compatible database software as there would be little love lost between me and MySQL. > > I hope this perspective helps a bit in considering this decision, > Do remember that there's an alternative to MySQL/MariaDB: PostgreSQL. I'm actually busy migrating the Windows infrastructure, and my target database is PostgreSQL. Note: I am *not* recommending that Ubuntu replaced its default database from MySQL to PostgreSQL; If a company already deployed a MySQL-based app, then it should migrate to MariaDB, if only to prevent being trapped by Oracle into migrating into Oracle. But for those still exploring a migration to Linux, I won't hesitate to push them toward PostgreSQL instead. There are clear benefits of PostgreSQL over MySQL for the enterprise, and vv. Rgds,

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[Maria-discuss] MariaDB 5.3.4-rc now available
by Daniel Bartholomew 16 Feb '12

16 Feb '12

The MariaDB project would like to announce the availability of MariaDB 5.3.4-rc, the latest addition to our growing lineup of supported software. MariaDB 5.3.4-rc is the second Release Candidate release in the 5.3 series. We hope to follow it up soon with a stable (GA) 5.3 release. == MariaDB 5.3.4-rc Release Notes, Changelog, Downloads =============== The release notes for MariaDB 5.3.4-rc are available from: http://kb.askmonty.org/en/mariadb-534-release-notes A complete changelog for this beta is available from: http://kb.askmonty.org/en/mariadb-534-changelog Sources, binaries and packages can be downloaded from: http://downloads.askmonty.org/mariadb/5.3.4/ Debian and Ubuntu packages are available from our mirrored apt repositories. A sources.list generator can be found at: http://downloads.askmonty.org/mariadb/repositories/ == About MariaDB 5.3 ================================================== The MariaDB 5.3 series introduces many new features, includes MariaDB 5.2, and is based on MariaDB 5.1 & MySQL 5.1. Some highlights of new features in MariaDB 5.3 include: - subquery optimizations that finally make subqueries usable - many optimizer changes, including Classic Hash Join, Batched Key Access, a new implementation of Multi-Range-Read optimizations as well as Index Condition Pushdown - NoSQL-style interfaces via the HandlerSocket plugin as well as dynamic columns - group commit in XtraDB when the binary log is enabled - Microsoft Windows performance improvements These are just some of the highlights, and for a more complete list of changes, please read the What is MariaDB 5.3 page: http://kb.askmonty.org/en/what-is-mariadb-53 == User Feedback plugin =============================================== MariaDB 5.3 includes a User Feedback plugin. This plugin is disabled by default. If enabled, it submits basic, completely anonymous MariaDB usage information. This information is used by the developers to track trends in MariaDB usage to better guide development efforts. If you would like to help make MariaDB better, please add --plugin-load=feedback.so to your my.cnf file! On Windows, add "feedback=ON" to your my.ini file, or click the checkbox during the installation of the MSI package. See http://kb.askmonty.org/en/user-feedback-plugin for more information. == MariaDB Crash Course book ========================================== We would also like to mention the book "MariaDB Crash Course", by Ben Forta. This book -- for beginner to intermediate level users -- will get you up and running with MariaDB, even if you've never used a database before. More information is available at: http://forta.com/books/0321799941/ == Quality ============================================================ The project always strives for quality, but in reality, nothing is perfect. Please take time to report any issues you encounter at: https://bugs.launchpad.net/maria We hope you enjoy MariaDB 5.3.4-rc! -- Daniel Bartholomew MariaDB - http://mariadb.org Monty Program - http://montyprogram.com AskMonty Knowledgebase - http://kb.askmonty.org

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Re: [Maria-discuss] MySQL's future in Debian and Ubuntu
by Robbie Williamson 16 Feb '12

16 Feb '12

On 02/13/2012 01:20 AM, Eddie Bachle wrote: > I would like to say we would still switch, or still heavily consider it > for the grains that could be made by using Ubuntu, however > realistically, the lack of native MySQL in any OS would be a huge mark > against it. FTR, we would not *drop* MySQL support. Worst case scenario, we'd place them in partner, much like we did with sun-java. The change would be that our default/recommended DB would be MariaDB. > Also that being said, if the technical concerns are > answered adequately for a vast majority of applications and hardware/OS > setups, then I would be totally behind switching to a more open source > friendly and compatible database software as there would be little love > lost between me and MySQL. One thing to note, the primary motivator for this proposal isn't about moving to a more "open source friendly" application. We have genuine security concerns/issues with how MySQL handles and publishes their security updates. We can't simply update supported prior Ubuntu releases to newer MySQL versions, so we have to backport patches. Their lack of information and access to the bugs addressed makes it *very* time consuming and difficult for our security and SRU teams to do this. If we can resolve these issues, then MySQL's future in main looks much brighter. -Robbie -- Robbie Williamson <robbie(a)ubuntu.com> robbiew[irc.freenode.net] "Don't make me angry...you wouldn't like me when I'm angry." -Bruce Banner

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Re: [Maria-discuss] [debian-mysql] MySQL's future in Debian and Ubuntu
by Colin Charles 16 Feb '12

16 Feb '12

Hi! On 13 Feb 2012, at 15:20, Eddie Bachle wrote: > As Linux gains more public recognition, more and more Windows-only organizations will consider using it as an alternative, especially for their web servers. This is especially true because of the fact that each of the necessarily main components of a web server exist in Linux in the same form as the do on Windows and often run much better. Then, the only piece one would need to learn would be the new operating system, not the database, HTTP server, or PHP scripting language software. However, this is going to be a more difficult proposition if the aforementioned advantage is somewhat eliminated. Were I to have to tell my boss that we could switch to Ubuntu but it would mean that would need to use a "MySQL compatible" database if we want to use the native database (which we likely would because it's tested to be stable and it is supported by the developers), then she would be much more hesitant. I reckon MySQL will always be available -- this discussion is about a supported release, especially from a security POV > There simply is a much greater sense of trepidation for those who are not significantly Linux savvy if there exists a possibility that they would have to make something work in an unfamiliar environment, especially if it were to happen unexpectedly. If we ported our www website server over to Ubuntu and then 6 months down the road we were to upgrade our Joomla version and there became an issue with MariaDB because it lacks some MySQL feature that it needs, or even that Joomla would fail to recognize Maria as being equivalent to MySQL at some point, then that would be a huge detraction against switching. More and more software out there also state it works with MariaDB. While your particular example of Joomla! doesn't, another popular CMS like Drupal has had MariaDB on its list for quite some time. (see: http://drupal.org/requirements -- "Recommended: MySQL (or an equivalent such as MariaDB)") > Unless assurances that any software that asks for MySQL will recognize and accept MariaDB equivalents, and that this should always be the case, and that it will retain the stability and recognized benefits of MySQL, I would encourage extreme caution in encouraging a switch. Linux is beginning to grow into areas it previously didn't reach and bringing a far I can totally understand your concern and assure you that MariaDB developers ensure compatibility and treat it as a very high requirement. Backwards compatible is one of our goals and we've never broken that. Extensive testing and QA helps too naturally cheers, -c -- Colin Charles, http://bytebot.net/blog/ | twitter: @bytebot | skype: colincharles MariaDB: Community developed. Feature enhanced. Backward compatible. Download it at: http://www.mariadb.org/ Open MariaDB/MySQL documentation at the Knowledgebase: http://kb.askmonty.org/

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[Maria-discuss] New KB Question: millisecond part is trimmed away when saving Java Date obj by hibernate
by Daniel Bartholomew 14 Feb '12

14 Feb '12

A new question has been posted in the Knowledgebase: http://kb.askmonty.org/en/millisecond-part-is-trimmed-away-when-saving-java… ---------------------------------------- Hi, I recently upgraded my MySQL DB to MariaDB for millisecond support. I can see the millisecond part in my upgraded database. And I tested the millisecond support by inserting a row to a table of my db. It functions well. But when I use hibernate to save a java.util.Date obj into database, millisecond part is trimmed and in MariaDB date obj is saved as: 2012-02-13 18:40:55.000. Do I need to set up something to activate millisecond support? Or I need to config hibernate for millisecond support? Thanks a lot! ---------------------------------------- Thanks. -- Daniel Bartholomew MariaDB - http://mariadb.org Monty Program - http://montyprogram.com AskMonty Knowledgebase - http://kb.askmonty.org

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Re: [Maria-discuss] MySQL's future in Debian and Ubuntu
by Marc Deslauriers 13 Feb '12

13 Feb '12

On Mon, 2012-02-13 at 02:20 -0500, Eddie Bachle wrote: > In general, I am generally an simply an observer on most of these > mailing lists, however my concerns with a switch are far less > technical and far more practical. I work currently for a college in > Michigan which utilizes almost solely Windows servers simply because > it is what the IT staff here knows. As a student here, I was brought > in to assist with the web server administration, and as time went by > because I have a degree of Linux knowledge, I was given permission to > put together a Ubuntu LAMP server to serve a couple of interested > parties on campus who wanted simply to demo several small scale web > apps that were Linux exclusive. This server would serve as an > exception to the general rule of our server architecture. However as > time has went by and my knowledge looks more like it will be a fixture > here after graduation, along with the simple instability of PHP and > Apache on the Windows platform, my boss is giving far more > consideration to moving to Linux. > > > As Linux gains more public recognition, more and more Windows-only > organizations will consider using it as an alternative, especially for > their web servers. This is especially true because of the fact that > each of the necessarily main components of a web server exist in Linux > in the same form as the do on Windows and often run much better. > Then, the only piece one would need to learn would be the new > operating system, not the database, HTTP server, or PHP scripting > language software. However, this is going to be a more difficult > proposition if the aforementioned advantage is somewhat eliminated. > Were I to have to tell my boss that we could switch to Ubuntu but it > would mean that would need to use a "MySQL compatible" database if we > want to use the native database (which we likely would because it's > tested to be stable and it is supported by the developers), then she > would be much more hesitant. If you prefer MySQL, you'll still be able to manually install it MySQL on Ubuntu and Debian, much like you manually install it on Windows. > > > There simply is a much greater sense of trepidation for those who are > not significantly Linux savvy if there exists a possibility that they > would have to make something work in an unfamiliar environment, > especially if it were to happen unexpectedly. If we ported our www > website server over to Ubuntu and then 6 months down the road we were > to upgrade our Joomla version and there became an issue with MariaDB > because it lacks some MySQL feature that it needs, or even that Joomla > would fail to recognize Maria as being equivalent to MySQL at some > point, then that would be a huge detraction against switching. I predict it will be the opposite. Once distros and people start switching to MariaDB, other projects will be testing on MariaDB by default, and compatibility with MySQL will then become problematic. Marc.

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[Maria-discuss] New KB Question: ODBC
by Daniel Bartholomew 08 Feb '12

08 Feb '12

A new question has been posted to the Knowledgebase: http://kb.askmonty.org/en/mariadb-odbc ==================== Is there an ODBC driver for use with MariaDB that is compatible with the driver provided with MySQL? ==================== Thanks. -- Daniel Bartholomew MariaDB - http://mariadb.org Monty Program - http://montyprogram.com AskMonty Knowledgebase - http://kb.askmonty.org

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[Maria-discuss] New KB Question: Locking SQL_MODE against client changes
by Daniel Bartholomew 05 Feb '12

05 Feb '12

A new question has been posted in the Knowledgebase: http://kb.askmonty.org/en/locking-sql_mode-against-client-changes ==================== Is there any way for locking out sql_mode against client-side changes other than MySQL Proxy (which does not allow for SSL connections)? Perhaps some MariaDB-specific setting? ==================== Thanks. -- Daniel Bartholomew MariaDB - http://mariadb.org Monty Program - http://montyprogram.com AskMonty Knowledgebase - http://kb.askmonty.org

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